160 degree "fail safe" thermostat
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Thread: 160 degree "fail safe" thermostat

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    Default 160 degree "fail safe" thermostat

    Help

    Went to 3 auto parts stores and 1 speed shop(Murrays here in Fla.) , no one has the above type thermostat. Changing out my 180 for a 160.

    Where do you guys order them from?
    Bill

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    Veteran Member HogV8's Avatar
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    Auto Zone .

    Jack
    Jack DeLelys......2000 Boss Hoss 350/400 HP

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    Veteran Member Gaston 2005 502's Avatar
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    A newbie here, 2005 502 bought from Lima Auto mall. Checked for a thermostat, not one from the factory. put a 160 in, temp went up, pulled it back out. I always heard in a car, you have to have a thermostat to keep the water actually cooling the motor, preventing the water from moving through the block, heads, water pump and radiator too fast to thoroughly cool the motor & heads. Thought about this considerably and in my opinion with a car you do have to have a thermostat, reason is water pump and hose size to and from radiator, block heads waterpump etc. is large enough to allow a large amount of water to flow through and not get a chance to cool the motor as needed. With a BH though due to the sizes of the water hoses the coolant can't flow too fast through the radiator, waterpump, block and heads, thus allowing the block and heads to be cooled as needed without a thermostat. JMHO, but then again, what the hell do i know. How about it those in the know?

    Darryl
    Darryl Campbell

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    Senior Member wtrippe's Avatar
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    Darryl
    My 97 smallblock would heat up when on the expressway at high speeds, so I installed a 160 stat and the motor ran hotter, so I gutted out the stat and installed just the stat housing problem gone. I think by slowing the water down help cool the engine at high speed.
    My .02
    Wayne

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    Veteran Member Adrian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaston 2005 502
    A newbie here, 2005 502 bought from Lima Auto mall. Checked for a thermostat, not one from the factory. put a 160 in, temp went up, pulled it back out. I always heard in a car, you have to have a thermostat to keep the water actually cooling the motor, preventing the water from moving through the block, heads, water pump and radiator too fast to thoroughly cool the motor & heads. Thought about this considerably and in my opinion with a car you do have to have a thermostat, reason is water pump and hose size to and from radiator, block heads waterpump etc. is large enough to allow a large amount of water to flow through and not get a chance to cool the motor as needed. With a BH though due to the sizes of the water hoses the coolant can't flow too fast through the radiator, waterpump, block and heads, thus allowing the block and heads to be cooled as needed without a thermostat. JMHO, but then again, what the hell do i know. How about it those in the know?

    Darryl
    A thermostat makes great since with a water pump that has variable speed and volume but we don't have such a thing. Our electric pump runs one speed and the size of the radiator outlets, a thermostat is not needed or the Factory would put one in every bike. If a great part of your ridding is in very cold weather then it might be the answer but even that would not persuade me to run one.

    Adrian

    People are lonely because they build Walls Instead of Bridges.

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    Veteran Member HogV8's Avatar
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    I tried a thermostat but ended up removing it . Since I installed a radiator Grille I've found that the grille reduces the air flow just enough where the coolant stays at about 180 most of the time under normal riding weather conditions without a thermostat . Yes it will run cooler when the embient air temp is cooler but riding under normal summer temps . it will run about 175-180 degrees . The only advantage I could see with the thermostat is the engine did warm up faster .

    Jack
    Jack DeLelys......2000 Boss Hoss 350/400 HP

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaston 2005 502
    A newbie here, 2005 502 bought from Lima Auto mall. Checked for a thermostat, not one from the factory. put a 160 in, temp went up, pulled it back out. I always heard in a car, you have to have a thermostat to keep the water actually cooling the motor, preventing the water from moving through the block, heads, water pump and radiator too fast to thoroughly cool the motor & heads. Thought about this considerably and in my opinion with a car you do have to have a thermostat, reason is water pump and hose size to and from radiator, block heads waterpump etc. is large enough to allow a large amount of water to flow through and not get a chance to cool the motor as needed. With a BH though due to the sizes of the water hoses the coolant can't flow too fast through the radiator, waterpump, block and heads, thus allowing the block and heads to be cooled as needed without a thermostat. JMHO, but then again, what the hell do i know. How about it those in the know?

    Darryl
    Interesting fact on the failsafe thermostat and the theory that restriction is needed to cool the engine. I am sure there are conditions where this theory of restriction needed can be both true and false. The failsafe thermostats only difference from other thermostats is that it locks permanently open after an engine overheats at a very high temperature (maybe 260 degrees but I don't remember). The thermostat is designed to have minimum restriction until replaced after an engine has overheated. There would still be some restriction from the fact that it is there but the design is to flow maximum coolant. There is no other safety from this thermostat except helping prevent engine damage on an extremely overheating engine. There is nothing keeping the thermostat from failing closed although I find it unlikely.

    Shane

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    Veteran Member crazymf's Avatar
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    Well, I'm going to just flat out disagree with Adrian and maybe we'll have to agree to disagree. GM designed the system to have a thermostat, and unless you've got 75-80 degree days throughout your life, the engine will run at a minimum temperature of changing values depending on the weather.

    While I've never heard of an engine failing on a BH because of this, to me that's just not right. I need my engine to run at a minimum temperature for my FI to work properly. Granted, that's adjustable and I've got it set at 105 degrees to go into closed loop. Not only that, but when I first bought my bike and rode through a couple 25 degree days, it was running at 120 degrees. That can't be good for an extended period, so in this country that means a thermostat is a must.

    However, if people want to run without one and everything is good, that's fine with me. I'm certainly not trying to tell anyone else what to do, just what I do.


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    Veteran Member Adrian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazymf
    Well, I'm going to just flat out disagree with Adrian and maybe we'll have to agree to disagree. GM designed the system to have a thermostat, and unless you've got 75-80 degree days throughout your life, the engine will run at a minimum temperature of changing values depending on the weather.

    While I've never heard of an engine failing on a BH because of this, to me that's just not right. I need my engine to run at a minimum temperature for my FI to work properly. Granted, that's adjustable and I've got it set at 105 degrees to go into closed loop. Not only that, but when I first bought my bike and rode through a couple 25 degree days, it was running at 120 degrees. That can't be good for an extended period, so in this country that means a thermostat is a must.

    However, if people want to run without one and everything is good, that's fine with me. I'm certainly not trying to tell anyone else what to do, just what I do.
    Stu

    I am glad you disagree with me because I was sure you were a sleep.
    I know that a fuel injection requires some temperature to operate normal and I learned from experience after pulling the thermostat out of a F I motor.
    I have very little interest in F I on Boss Hoss (might need to perk up though) but my biggest interest in the rider and keeping them cool.
    I doubt that very many folks will wear out their ZZ-4 engines due to the low millage, and load they carry so I could care less about the longevity of the thing.
    My comfort is what really maters to me and my friends.

    Adrian

    People are lonely because they build Walls Instead of Bridges.

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    Yeah, I was asleep for a while, but I'm awake now...


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    My experience without the thermostat was that if riding 60 degrees or lower the engine would never warm up it would run around 120 degrees. My goal with having installed a thermostat is to keep the engine operating in a small range of temperatures after warming up. The less variance in temperature is better for longevity of headgaskets when using aluminum heads on a cast iron block. I feel a lower temperature thermostat 160 or 170 that just helps prevent very low temperatures but does not get the engine warm enough to activate the fan often. Which is my other goal to keep engine temperature naturally below fan turn on temp as much as possible. I guess I am looking for alot in my temperature operation but am fairly content with how I have gotten my bike to operate in my climate and riding style. As for bigblocks I don't even remember anyone in the cooler climates feeling the need for thermostats on them but I have now experience to be sure.

    Shane

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    Veteran Member crazymf's Avatar
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    Shane,
    For a young .... like you, you seem to have a good grasp on things. I appreciate your point of view. Too bad you're not old enough to test drive a Boss Hoss. dig dig.


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    Veteran Member Green Bean's Avatar
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    I'm sure climate would make a difference in the way we would want to cool/warm our engines. If I were running in Stu's neck of the woods I don't think that my setup would be good. Here in Florida it gets very hot in the summer and a BB runs hotter than a SB. I increased my water flow through my cooling system and decreased my operating temp by 30 degrees. My bike use to run 225 degrees in slow traffic on a hot day and the fan never turned off. That was unbearable. Now it never gets above 195 degrees even on the hottest day in any traffic. I would never consider running a thermostat and restricting water flow after I put so much into increasing it. But, that's here in Florida and not at the North Pole!

    Heck, I even considered pulling my heads and drilling out the head gaskets to increase the water flow even more but after going through this summer, I don't think it's necessary.
    Ricky
    (Redtro)

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    Veteran Member Adrian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SRF
    My experience without the thermostat was that if riding 60 degrees or lower the engine would never warm up it would run around 120 degrees. My goal with having installed a thermostat is to keep the engine operating in a small range of temperatures after warming up. The less variance in temperature is better for longevity of headgaskets when using aluminum heads on a cast iron block. I feel a lower temperature thermostat 160 or 170 that just helps prevent very low temperatures but does not get the engine warm enough to activate the fan often. Which is my other goal to keep engine temperature naturally below fan turn on temp as much as possible. I guess I am looking for alot in my temperature operation but am fairly content with how I have gotten my bike to operate in my climate and riding style. As for bigblocks I don't even remember anyone in the cooler climates feeling the need for thermostats on them but I have now experience to be sure.

    Shane
    We are a lot like the Florida boys and it does get hot here on some days (100 plus).
    When it gets to 40 to 50 degrees both Cozaey and my trikes seem to run at 150 degrees. Hers is just a little over 150 and mine dead on so 150 is about as low as it does except on a super cold day, 30 degrees, I have seen 130 but if I stop it will warm up to 150.

    Adrian

    People are lonely because they build Walls Instead of Bridges.

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    Veteran Member EastnMike's Avatar
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    My 2002 385 is fuel injected, and I have never ran a thermostat. I have never had a problem at all (maybe I have been fortunate so far). I ride it to work every day, and the temp range varies from 100+ in the summer to 5 degrees sometimes in the winter. Over the past couple of weeks, I have been on night shifts, and it has been in the low to mid-twenties every morning at 6am for the 25 mile one-way ride. The engine temps usually agerage 110-120 (I assume) in the mornings. I know I always let the bike warm up to at least 150 degrees before I leave, and it quickly drops after I get started. The FI system has never given me a problem after doing this for years now. I may simply be fortunate, and it may be the warm up time I am allowing it is helping a lot. I have 41,000 miles on her now, and I couldn't be happier. I am thinking however of changing the 15-50 Mobil 1 out to the 10W-30 for the winter months. I have always ran the 15W-50 so far. I do have a set of stainless panels I fabricated to go in front of the radiator, but I haven't put them on this year as of yet. I have always been skeptical of any flow obstruction of the cooling system using an electrical pump. I am still running the factory pumps, both water and fuel. I sure do pray this message doesn't jinx me or my bike... :D
    Mike
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    Veteran Member crazymf's Avatar
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    Mike,
    The problem is that the FI system stays in open loop until a preset temperature, which means it will run in start mode, rich. The preset may be low enough that 110 degrees might do it. I know with my former Howell FI, 125 degrees didn't do it. The bike will still run, but richer than necessary and mileage will suffer.

    stu


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    Veteran Member escortbike's Avatar
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    Shane will be old enough to demo a Boss Hoss on 5 December 2009.
    Special trip by Shane to Dyersburg at that time is needed!
    Bill Van Sant


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    Veteran Member crazymf's Avatar
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    I think we should band together and get him a baby soother to wear until then.

    Hell, why not go all the way and make HIM wear the pink panties too until he's old enough to pass them on... hehe


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    Veteran Member HossZZ4's Avatar
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    Default Toyrun temp

    Went on a Toy Run this saturday to the Henchmens hangout in Tracy.
    Hells Angels came by to "supervise"...... I was wearing 4 police memorial run pins and I felt like I was either keeping the peace or waiting for several hundred slugs to hit me in the chest....

    In the 45 minute ride from my house, with windchill, had to be close to freezing and wearing all the gear I wear for cold weather riding, my hands were popsicles and my snot frose. The bike didnt get past 150 degrees until I stopped at a light for a few minutes and it went up to 160.... Turned the fan on but the bike wasnt hot enough to heat me up!
    Bike didnt like that temp neither...wasnt running well. Ran much better on the return trip around noon, when it had warmed up a bit and the bike could run at 160-165 degrees.

    Cheers
    Aldo

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    Default Re: Toyrun temp

    Quote Originally Posted by HossZZ4
    Went on a Toy Run this saturday to the Henchmens hangout in Tracy.
    Hells Angels came by to "supervise"...... I was wearing 4 police memorial run pins and I felt like I was either keeping the peace or waiting for several hundred slugs to hit me in the chest....

    In the 45 minute ride from my house, with windchill, had to be close to freezing and wearing all the gear I wear for cold weather riding, my hands were popsicles and my snot frose. The bike didnt get past 150 degrees until I stopped at a light for a few minutes and it went up to 160.... Turned the fan on but the bike wasnt hot enough to heat me up!
    Bike didnt like that temp neither...wasnt running well. Ran much better on the return trip around noon, when it had warmed up a bit and the bike could run at 160-165 degrees.



    So I guess by your post you do not run a thermostat?I run a 160 degree in mine and it stays about 180 except in traffic on a hot day it climbs ,but it did that without one also.

    Cheers
    Aldo

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    Veteran Member Bryan Ward's Avatar
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    Obviously, we have to run a thermostat in the fall and spring up here. I use a 160 high flow and it will keep the temp at 185 to 190 even at close to freezing temperatures. Otherwise it runs so cold that it can't be good for it.,

    Bryan



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